President Benson told us that we should be Flooding the Earth with the Book of Mormon. Unfortunately, my stake Relief Society president took prophetic counsel very seriously.
President Susan Easton Black called all the ward Relief Society presidents together. They would host a stake Relief Society homemaking fair, focused on — you got it — flooding the earth with the Book of Mormon. It would be awesome and wondrous! We'd be inspired! And everyone would take giant leaps in responding to the call of the prophet.
When the “good news” trickled down to me, it was not so well-received. Each ward had been given an area of focus. Each sister was to create (a word that always causes severe respiratory distress) something to display (gasp, gasp) that would help to “flood the earth” with this book of scripture.
One ward was assigned home decor. So the sisters in that ward would create, presumably, table cloths, curtains, and chair cushions that proclaimed the Word in some fashion. Another was assigned artwork and would, then, fashion scripture-emblazoned cross-stitch samplers and depict scripture stories in watercolors and oils. Another ward was assigned to flood us with Family Home Evening ideas with things like Book of Mormon figure puppets, flannel board drawings, etc. Another ward created quiet books. One ward was assigned music and so wrote songs about Book of Mormon people and principles.
Our ward was assigned children's games.
You'll note that each of the assignments required creativity, something I was utterly shortchanged on when talents were being divvied up. I think I ended up in the “Trials and Oddities to Make Sure You Don't Fit In” line twice, instead.
I sunk lower in my chair. I wasn't going to go. They couldn't make me.
For a number of weeks I excused myself from the assignment, leaving it to the more worthy and talented sisters — meaning pretty much everyone else in the ward. My part would be to encourage and support them in their efforts.
Then, at a presidency meeting just over a week before The Big Event, the Relief Society president said, “I hope at least each of you has something to display. We need to support Sister Black.” President Javadi had spoken…and I was her first counselor.
Guilt weighed heavily on my soul. Yes, I'll go to the meeting! I'll help set up tables! I'll serve at the luncheon! Just don't force me to make something! I stewed and prayed for a number of days. There simply wasn't anything I could do. As Napoleon Dynamite would say, I didn't have the skills. Everyone was creating some really amazing, beautiful thing. Anything I did would just detract from the Spirit.
One night that week while praying, again, to be relieved of the obligation and guilt for not doing my part, my mind was opened to something I had never considered.
My skills and interests were not typical for LDS women or most women of any affiliation in my generation. They weren't ones that were stressed in Young Women or promoted in Homemaking Meeting. They weren't the kind you heard when glowingly lauding Godly women from the pulpit. Still, they could be used to glorify God and to further his work!
Raising my daughter, homemaking, and serving in church took most of my time every day. The single other thing that I had been focusing on was learning to program computers. So, when Jessica was napping the next afternoon, I sat down to write a Book of Mormon computer game. It was called Book of Mormon Trivia Time and had the incredible features of:
- asking multiple choice scripture questions
- giving visual and auditory feedback depending upon whether the answer was right or wrong
Unquestionably cutting edge.
My favorite question asked what the brother of Jared asked the Lord to touch to give light to his ships. The choices were: light bulbs, stones, sticks, and oxen.
When my creation was complete, I puzzled about how to display my work. Laptops didn't exist in 1989 and lugging a computer to the conference (and then guarding it for the afternoon) wasn't feasible. Finally I settled on printing out some screen shots, writing a few captions, and pasting them clumsily on poster board. (Read that: pasted on poster board by someone with no die cut, embellishment, or calligraphy skills whatsoever.)
I showed up bright and early on Saturday to help set up. But as soon as I walked into the room and saw what everyone else was offering I felt like the little drummer boy who came to bang on some bongos while everyone else gave gold, frankincense , and myrrh. I quickly turned to leave, just to get back to the car to hide the cobalt blue board of horror. Then someone called my name.
Slowly I went back in and revealed the embarrassment. I laughed aloud about it, stating that I knew it was silly, but it was all I could do. I deflected the scorn by putting it down myself, first.
During the conference I simply avoided our ward's display table, busying myself with other things. Then, finally, we sat down for the luncheon and President Black's address. Just as we did, the curtains in the back of the room parted and President Benson walked in. Himself. In person. His son, apparently, had been in the building early that morning. He had seen that we had taken action on his father's counsel. He called his dad and told him he needed to see this. And he came.
Unbeknownst to us, when the stake Relief Society presidency has learned he was coming, they had gone from display to display, choosing one item from each ward to present to the prophet. Most incredibly, they chose mine. A few minutes later, someone came to my table and asked me to go to the stand and present my game board to President Benson.
Sitting on my desk is the huge, bright yellow book we were given at the fair. Warning! Flood the Earth! it proclaims boldly on the cover. It has samples of and patterns for many of the wonderful things presented at the conference. My program is not included in the book and I'm sure no one remembers it but me. But that was the first time I realized that my contribution — though different and even unusual — is a valuable part of the kingdom.
Oh, girl!! Soooo much to say, and I have an appointment coming in 2 minutes. Suffice it, for now, to say that:
1) Lack of Creativity is NOT an issue with you!! Look at your writings! Look at your thought patterns! YOU got extra doses of creativity! Granted, it may not be in the area called arts and crafts (I don’t remember— just taking your word for it), but you are one of the most creative people I know. I remember wishing (inappropriately, mind you) that I was more like you, and I would still envy your obvious talents and wish them for myself if I didn’t know better and hadn’t learned to appreciate and be satisfied with the talents the Lord gave me. I have no doubt that everyone on this list FAR exceeds ME in the area of arts and crafts and anything having to do with ‘model mormon woman’ creativity.
2) I, also, was blessed with alternative creativity methods. It’s as much a blessing as a curse– it’s all in the perception. Creating a computer game was PERFECT and had far more impact than many of the other things I’m sure were displayed, but the Lord loved their efforts, as well. Everyone did their best in that particular moment. YOU are exactly what God intended you to be, and continue to be exactly where He intends you to be as long as you continue to strive to do your best. He wouldn’t change a single thing about you in this moment. Now– in the next moment He probably expects you to stretch yourself a bit and grow just a little bit, and then you will again be PERFECT in that particular moment!
Gotta run. I’ll share more later.
Sharilee (Javadi) Guest
Just a note: I have only been married to one man. He changed our name arbitrarily because he did not like his father’s name. It works– I consider myself to be named after the poet Edgar A. Guest . . . I have to live with myself and so I want to be fit for myself to know . . .
You are kind.
I have learned, over the years, many of the things you say. But, understand, at the time I saw “good Mormon women” to be something entirely based on what I saw around me and what was promoted at church and by the church. Creativity WAS arts and crafts. It certainly wasn’t programming. And I didn’t write back then. Didn’t even think I liked writing. Even after I had published a number of articles over a decade ago, my dad spent some time trying to convince me that I was, too, an “author.”
I don’t know if you remember the whole “craft retard” thing that started at homemaking in our ward. I was elected president of the “craft retard club,” because everything I tried to make was a complete disaster. One other woman was similarly “honored” as president of the “craft dyslexic club” because she repeatedly made the item backwards.
As for #2, I hope I didn’t give the impression that my contribution was BETTER because it was selected. Again, I think that was a time when God spoke my language, immature though it was (and is). He knew being selected, to me, would be equated with being acceptable to him and I really, really needed to feel accepted, when I usually felt so out of place. “Doing my best” didn’t mean trying my best to fit the stereotype that I had learned or pretending to enjoy things I didn’t. It meant being the best ME, using MY talents and interests to do good. I could be a good Mormon woman and still like the things I did and be interested in the things I was (and even have no skill in many things) because being a good Mormon woman didn’t require me to sew and scrapbook. I had never thought my personality and the gospel could fit together.
M changed your last name???
Ahhh, well done!
And your article made my point for me, in a much better way than I communicated it in the other thread!
You felt “less than” when it came to “The Model Mormon Woman”. But that was you. There certainly may have been times when someone actually said something stupid that made you buy into the notion that “The Model Mormon Woman” was always in a pink blouse covered in lace, or baked all her own bread and sewed all her kids’ clothes.
But you assumed that everyone else thought you were less than, and would put down and brush aside your project. But the truth was that they were so impressed with it, that they chose YOURS to show the prophet. And certainly, it’s possible that had you told someone what you were going to do ahead of time, that they might have said “You’re going to do what?”
But this is exactly what I meant about YW who feel “less than”, “not as good as”, “not as perfect as”, “not as righteous as”, assuming that the leaders, or girls look down on them, and think that they are being “forced” to fit into the “perfect mold” that they think the leaders have set up for them.
No doubt there are going to be snooty women and girls who really do think they are better than someone else, who really do think that they’re so righteous and pious (which only reflects that they aren’t), and look down on others who don’t dress like them, who don’t sew as well, who don’t bake their own bread, who aren’t as good at scripture chases, etc.
But I would say, that more often, it’s the girl or sister who has a self-image problem, a self-worth problem of feeling “less than” that pulls herself away from the program and the other girls/women rather than the them driving the girl or woman out.
I’ve seen it happen over and over again in YW and in RS.
And I was once one of those girls myself.
I often thought the other girls looked down on me because my parents weren’t married in the temple, or because I wasn’t going to seminary, wasn’t going on temple trips, etc. I had a “boyfriend” at 16 that I was dating exclusively. I even dated a guy who was 21. I wasn’t drinking, smoking, partying or having sex, but I wasn’t the “model mormon young woman” either.
The truth is, some of that wasn’t my fault, and some of it was. I dated people I never should have dated. I was at church every Sunday, but I wasn’t going to seminary, wasn’t reading my scriptures, wasn’t having family prayer or scripture study in my home, wasn’t doing my Personal Progress, etc. No one ever said anything derogatory or pushed me out of their group. But I thought that theythought I was “less than”…because I FELT less than, and they did not do anything to make me feel that way.
Because of my own insecurities, I kind of ignored and sometimes even put down (behind her back, of course)the one girl I really should have been friends with. The girl I probably really needed to be friends with. Vicky Paxton. She was the “perfect girl” in our ward. She made all her own dresses, got straight A’s, came from a family of 12 children, parents married in the temple, she had all her seminary scriptures memorized, always knew where to find a scripture, and her reading chart hanging on the YW wall, (where they also held seminary) was always marked far ahead of the rest of the class. She was ALWAYS nice to me, and I was always nice to her to her face (I think… I hope so!), but inside I held a resentment toward her. Resentment for being so perfect, so “molly mormon” and therefore, making me look bad. Or so I thought.
In my heart, I actually really liked her. How could I not like someone who was always so nice to me? But she was everything I wanted to be and felt I couldn’t be. I was downright jealous, period. So instead of being her friend, I made her the bad guy, and I’ve regreted it ever since.
Ah, c’mon Alison, it’s not fair to judge the Church based on old pics in the library! :shocked::wink:
Have you ever sent feedback to the magazine folks? I am confident they would listen and try to recognize where they might be able to do better. I think these are valid feedback points that are worth passing along.
I dont’ envy those who try to figure out how best to portray things like that, though. It’s hard to be all-inclusive, ya know? They have to think about international focus and balance and family makeup balance and personality styles….it’s a tough job, I’m sure! 🙂
And, btw, I was very grateful when Enrichment started the trend away from every RS meeting including crafts. Although it was the only time I ever did anything like that (because that’s not naturally my thing either), and I didn’t mind the chance to learn some things here and there that weren’t natural for me, I really, really want more focus on the depth of the gospel that can change our lives, not just the frilly stuff that we can display in our homes (or leave unfinished in our basements). 🙂
I don’t remember the “craft retard” thing. How funny— I should have at least been the Vice President. I not only can’t do them— I don’t even TRY! Of course— that’s probably why I didn’t know about it. I was probably able to be heavily involved in doing what I do best– organizing, leading, planning, whatever– and completely avoided the actual craft activity all together. I most likely spent my time being cheerleader for everyone else and taking care of details on the next activity so that no one noticed I didn’t even bother. As I recall– the Homemaking Counselor was ‘Ms. Homemaker’ herself, which was another testimony builder to me since I had no idea what anyone enjoyed or what their area of expertise was when I turned in the names. I was literally brand new to the ward, so I was pretty incredulous when it turned out that those supposed random names I turned in (of course– they were straight from the Lord!) ended up so unbelievably perfect!
Anyway– later in life when I was called to be the Homemaking Counselor, after laughing my head off for days, I settled into the calling and LOVED IT! The first thing I did was start centering the homemaking meetings around scriptures. I remember specifically telling the bishop that I would be happy to accept the calling as long as he understood that homemaking was a whole lot more than arts and crafts and I intended to focus on other areas. Armed with D&C 88:119 we began to focus each month on one area of the scripture, “Organize yourselves . . . and establish a house of prayer . . . fasting . . . faith . . . learning . . . glory . . . order . . . a house of God.” That covered 6 months, and to everyone’s surprise, attendance at homemaking meetings more than tripled! We had the token arts and crafts activity with each meeting that sisters could choose to make if they wanted to, but the core of the meeting was focused on establishing prayer, faith, learning, glory, and order in our homes. No one has ever mistaken me for an artsy craftsy person.
Speaking of mistaken identity– I find it very interesting to learn how insecure you felt at the time, although it’s not necessarily surprising to me now knowing that it’s not an isolated situation. From where I stood you were the epitomy of self-confidence. You had it ALL together, and then some. I, on the other hand, while having grown up with self-confidence and fairly solid self-esteem, was going through a self-identity crisis– or some kind of crisis, which perhaps explains why I don’t remember much of what you seem to remember (by the way— my child was born in Utah Valley hospital– I think it was Brenda). I realize that I have blocked out much of what happened during that time period. I was so worried at the time wondering how I could effectively serve as R.S. President when in the walls of my own home I was being beaten and battered. I was in shock and denial and trying to convince myself that it wasn’t really happening. After all, I had spent my entire life making wise choices so that I qualified for the blessing of being the perfect mother and having a happy, eternal marriage. I was in absolute shock as I began to realize who I had married. I absolutely adored Sister/President Black, not only because she is an incredible woman, but because she represented hope to me as the survivor, and thriver, of an abusive marriage. Perhaps calling me as President was the Lord’s way of letting me know that my worth and my ability to serve was not based on how someone else treated me, but that I still had the ability to bless others in spite of it. Anyway–
As for #2– the judgment that your contribution was better than the others was MY judgment based on what I was looking for. It’s not a judgment on quality or acceptance of the contributions, just on what I was looking for.
Yes . . . M changed our last name in 1999. Kind of weird, but whatever. At this point I like it because I can have the same name as my children but not really be tied to him or that part of my life. He has the same name now, of course, but I don’t really know him as that– to me he is the other name.
So many good comments by everyone, but I’d better get something done. That appointment ended up being a long one! I guess that’s what happens when you wear many hats. One meeting can end up being 2-3 meetings!
I don’t know Ali… I totally see your point, but I just did a pretty thorough search, and actually, if you go back through, there was a photo of a girl reading scriptures in that article. And the article itself does speak of helping girls learn to balance a checkbook, apply for college and even jobs- things outside of folding laundry and ironing. So okay, the photos didn’t depict a woman at a computer, solving a quadratic equation, or playing kickball with the kids, but rather showed photos of the more “classical” homemaking skills (which the article made a point of, by mentioning that the classical skills were beginning to fade in society as a whole– so maybe that’s why they chose the photos they did??) but I don’t think the lack of photos showing a woman at a computer, or teaching a class, is evidence of the Church as an institution trying to cram sewing and cooking down our throats. (I know you didn’t use those words, but that’s the gist I’m getting from what you’re saying. Am I misunderstanding?) And couldn’t the lack of photos that you hoped for simply be a matter of an Ensign staff member just not being careful about the photos they chose? If so, that’s something that could easily be addressed and changed with a letter to the editor.
If you go through ALL the pictures in all of 2005’s magazines, you’ll see that there are many pictures of women studying the scriptures, teaching classes, speaking from the pulpit, etc. You’ll also note that the pictures of men are very similar. They’re in their suits, praying, teaching, studying scripture, standing in front of the temple, passing/blessing the Sacrament, doing service… except for passing the sacrament of course, the photos of women are almost the exact same in nature as the photos of the men. It’s not like the photos of the men are all showing men fixing the car, cutting down trees, playing basketball with the boys, or even showing them at their a job, while only showing photos of women cooking, cleaning and sewing.
Do you see what I mean? And the ONLY photo out of all 12 issues from that year that shows a parent involved in their child’s sports, is a photo of a Mom at her son’s soccer game– not a Dad throwing around a ball with his son.
The March 2005 issue actually has an article addressing the issue of motherhood and homemaking not only being about cooking, sewing and cleaning. That’s it’s not meant to stop us from education, and doing other things with our lives. It speaks of reading good books, education, learning things online, and the author even talks about her hobby of writing novels — sounds alot like you.
All in all, I just don’t see a subliminal message being sent, either intentionally or unintentionally, that washing dishes, vacuuming, cooking and sewing, folding laundry are the role of a wife and mother. And actually, through all my life, though I HAVE heard these things addressed as part of a mother’s responsibility (which she can delegate to children AND husbands) in keeping a house of order, the role of mother as teacher, leader, gospel instructor, etc has always been the most emphasized.
I DO agree that doctrine and practice aren’t necessarily always in sync, as you pointed out. But it seems to me that the practice almost proves the opposite of what you’re saying. Women are in many leadership roles throughout the church– very “high ranking” ones, at that. They use computers all the time, make power point presentations, they exercise, teach their kids to ride bikes, help with homework, even entirely educate their children– all the things that you mention were missing from the photos in the article.
I also agree that they should have included a photo or two that DID show something along the lines of the examples you gave, but again, I just don’t see how the lack of them proves anything, either.
This morning I was browsing a bit through the MM posts that I missed over the last 3 weeks of not logging on. (I doubt will EVER get caught up, wow!) I read Sharilee’s post about how she had her last name changed. Then this afternoon I was reading the Ensign, and there I saw an answer to the “Q&A” section given by Sharilee Guest of Utah. So do we have a minor celebrity in our midst?
Ensign Article
I am going to chime in here if you don’t mind. I guess I am what most of you would consider a stereotypical LDS woman, I cook, I sew, I garden, I make things. Because of that I hear more negative comments than postive from other women. It seems to me that everyone assumes that those things just came naturally to me and that you can only do those things if you are born with the ability. My only gift is one of perserverance. None of those things came naturally or easily to me but I decided that I thought those things were important to learn so I did. It took many years of tears, practice, and failure before I got very good at any of those things. Somewhere along the line I actually began to enjoy doing those things as well.
I have spoken to older women in the church as they have reminisced about how Homemaking/Enrichment has changed over the years. One woman told me that when she started going to Relief Society over seventy years ago they had homemaking activities a few times a week. She said that without those activities she would have floundered as a wife and mother because that was where she learned to make bread and do the laundry the correct way and budget her money and all sorts of other necessary skills for that time. She said that the older women really had a hand in helping the new wives and mothers in the ward adjust to life and learn how to do all the things that was expected of them. All of those things sound like “Model Mormon Women” activities but at that time they were necessary. She also talked about the women’s literary magazine and the other educational benefits of Relief Society years ago and how she felt that even though she was a stay at home mother she was getting an education and how sad she was when the church discontinued that program.
Life for women has changed a lot. Now there are many more opportunities for women to do things that especially interest them rather than focus on things that maybe they don’t like to do, aren’t good at, or don’t really care about. I do think that there is still this dream that life will be like it seemed to once be and that every woman will feel satisfied at the end of the day when she has fed her family three nutritious, hot meals and her children are all perfectly groomed in matching clothes that she made for them and outside is a perfect little flower garden so that all the floral arrangements in her house can be fresh from the garden… The reality is different than that and most likely that dream is based purely on fantasy. I don’t believe that women in their aprons fifty years ago felt that they were doing any better than most of us feel that we are doing right now. Many of them probably didn’t like the ‘craft’ aspect of their lives but they didn’t have much of a choice back then. I think we are lucky because we have more freedom to decide what being a good woman means and we have the freedom to pursue that whether it’s being a bit of a gourmet cook or an inspirational speaker or a teacher…or anything else…and choosing one thing over another doesn’t mean that it’s better or worse than what someone else has chosen.
I do agree that the trend towards more Gospel based Enrichment nights is a good change. While learning homemaking skills forty years ago may have been very important and helpful to the women of that time nowadays nothing is more necessary than having a firm foundation in the Gospel.
Not a minor celebrity, but that is me. They asked a question about service and community involvement, and that’s kind of my area of expertise at the moment, so I decided I should send my thoughts. I hope they help someone enjoy their service a little more.
I’m not sure how old facethemusic is, but my guess is that you are at least a little bit younger than Alison and me (which is neither good nor bad!) I do remember that our YW activities were very focused on being the perfect wife and mother with no focus on lifetime learning or the ‘other’ things. We were not encouraged to continue our education nor prepare to be in the work force. We were encouraged to study the scriptures, but it certainly was not expected that we would be scriptorians. It was a very different world.
The good news is that we were right on the brink of what I view as positive progress. When I left on my mission in 1984 it was not very common yet, but by the time I came home it seemed to be a different world. I was a scriptorian and that was something that was suddenly valued. Going to school and preparing for a career were being encouraged from the pulpit, if only to be prepared in the case that our spouse was no longer there to provide. Anyway— you get the drift.
I believe that the Church definitely encourages the well-rounded development of young ladies today. There are probably some stereotypes that still show up out of habit or neglect. There are probably even some stereotypes that we as women play a role in promoting by virtue of our perception of ourselves and our roles and a hesitancy to give up our traditional roles. There are probably some positive aspects that have been ‘lost’ as a result of progress (women’s literary magazine and older women mentoring younger women), but hey . . . we have MM as our literary magazine, and I hope that each of us are taking time to be mentored by the older sisters, as well as the younger sisters and all of the sisters. We do live in a different world. I, personally, am glad to be here now as my skill set is much more conducive to the life I lead. I confess, I am not one to work really hard at developing new skills and interests that aren’t natural to me. Kudos to Rebecca! That is admirable! I enjoy soooo many things, that my challenge is usually learning to limit my activities and follow a few less passions at any given moment. My mantra at this point is that if I don’t enjoy it, I don’t do it. Of course, everything you do has a little something here or there that you don’t necessarily enjoy, and I still do it, but taken as a whole– if I’m not having fun I leave it to someone who is having fun and spend my time and energy elsewhere.
I am certainly grateful for all of the various views and words of wisdom that are shared in this forum. They help me to evaluate my own views and add more dimensions of understanding. Thank you, everyone, for sharing!
More great comments since I started responding, but I must go see to my domestic duties. 🙂 I’ll be back!
I’m not. I’m judging them by the lack of any pics at all. 🙂
Yes. And the curriculum people (another story for another day). Mostly ignored.
You are a blessed woman. Move to my ward!
Brenda? Could be. Just remember sitting on your couch having the discussion. Were you the one with the embedded gauze incident? (That’s as graphic as I dare be ?)
Well, I wasn’t really impressed by him, if that helps. But I had no clue what was going on. So sad. :/ I dealt with a few other instances of abuse of women in the ward after you flew the coop. Not fun.
It’s a little drawing of a young girl. I referenced the “cover and article photos” of the MOTHERS.
You’ll notice that I said it was a great article. You’ll also notice that the (great) article barely addresses to “classical” homemaking, domestic activities at all. So why do the photos all focus on that, instead of having the balance that was included in the article? I think it’s because that simply is how some people still see the woman’s role.
Yes, you’re misunderstanding. I didn’t say they were cramming anything. I have no objection to either cooking or sewing. (I just finished cooking dinner and my 9-year-old is working on a sewing project.)
What I’m saying is that when I was a child the church itself promoted, celebrated, catered to, discussed, and photographed almost exclusively a certain KIND of woman. There is nothing WRONG with that kind of woman, but those who weren’t that kind could very easily be excluded by the rhetoric.
The point isn’t to compare all covers from 2005, since I didn’t grow up in 2005. (For the record, I love the Ensign, think the editors generally do a great job, read it cover to cover every month with a highlighter, etc.) I already pointed out that I think things are better today. But there are still current examples (like this) of women being presented in a certain way without much room for variation. I think it’s something that could be dealt with better.
If there were an article on preparing sons to be fathers and all the photos were of dads and sons playing various sports, I would also find the presentation lopsided and misleading in its representation of fatherhood.
Yes, Molly, that’s “our” Sharilee.
Yeah, I was the imbedded gauze woman!! 🙂 By the way, I remembered Brenda’s name– her full name even. I like that edit feature, I can go back and correct typos, or memory glitches! I had already corrected before I saw your post, but you must have been reading already!
As far as who I married– he switched the day we got married. It was bizarre– at least it was bizarre until years later when I got an education on how abuse works and narcissism and all of that. We were married in the temple, though, and I had never EVER failed or given up on a dream in my life– so divorce wasn’t an option the day after we got married. The only option was to make the marriage work. It took me a loooong time to finally realize that I didn’t have to put up with it, and it became clear that he wasn’t going to change and the generational transmission of such behavior to my children became LESS of an option than divorce. In retrospect, I believe the Lord needed someone who had been there who would be willing to stand up and advocate for His daughters who were living with abuse because they thought they had to. He definitely got that in me. I have been an advocate in many ways, and I am grateful for the opportunities I have had to help other women survive and thrive. All is as it should be— even though it wasn’t the dream I had all those years in my childhood.
Well. I should probably attend to my domestic duties, too, but this is more fun! I am just grateful for a daughter who enjoys cooking. Actually, knowing what I know about the law of attraction I will also say how grateful I am for children who love to clean their rooms, vacuum, do dishes and especially clean the bathrooms!! 😉
Seriously, I have to confess that I am usually fastidious about my house being cleaned, and I haven’t even worried about it today. I even let someone come over today with it as is (okay— it isn’t really bad, but I usually go for perfection and letting someone in the house, or at least knowing they were coming and still not dropping everything else to clean it, is aBIG step!) You guys have even gotten me away from thinking about Book Wise non-stop! That is all I have thought about for the past two months since I figured out how to help the non-profits. I knew there would be something that would come along to take my attention. I never dreamt it would be this! I need to avoid developing an addiction. I really am going to go do something else for awhile.
Ok, it’s way too late right now to go find my Ensign & check out the pics. But I have been amazed over the years as RS had struggled to grow. I use the term struggled, not b/c the general RS Presidency has had issues, but local leaders & sisters have not transitioned well over the years. I was one of the 1st sisters who was divorced (a topic for another post) & really didn’t fit “in” & people weren’t sure what to make of me. But, back to the topic at hand. As I looked over RS on Sunday, we had a mix of every conceivable woman, young, old, married, widowed, single, divorced, w/ kids, no kids & empty nesters (me!!). I have lived through several RS presidents that struggled to get the sisters to fit the “mold” of a Molly. But, that’s like forcing a square peg into a round hole. I’m not saying that baking bread, gardening, etc is bad & they area wondeful attributes to have and serve many well. But, at today’s pace, the speed of light/life, many can not even conceive of acquiring those skills. An attempt to impart those skills to women who haven’t turned on their oven for months b/c they have been nuking their dinners or eating out can increase the already existing guilt we impose on ourselves. Most of us are just happy if we get a shower & a meal, even if it is drive thru!!! I think the goal for RS is & should be to meet the needs of the women, those women in each specific unit. What works for one ward may not work for another. The gospel message is there for all, but there is a time & season for those messages. And the is the job of the RS president & her counselors is to prayfully find & attempt to meet those needs, not to mention the responsibility of the sisters to let the RS pres. know what they want & need. We are all different, some of us are just more inclined to share our differences. And for anyone who has a problem with that, well it’s exactly that, their problem. Good night ladies, it’s actually Thursday on the East Coast & I have a 12 hour shift ahead of me in a few short hours…sweet dreams.
spitfire, nice to see you chiming in. I appreciate your persepctive.
Rebecca, I have never assumed that you (or anyone else) who can do something so well, didn’t put in the time to gain the skill. I hope I haven’t contributed to that negative impression. I admire those who can do these domestic things well as much as I admire those who can do other things well. I have been blessed by your skill, as well.
My objection is not to people doing, loving, and/or working at any of the classic domestic tasks. My two-fold objection is as follows:
(1) DEFINING womanhood or motherhood BY the classic domestic tasks
(2) Emphasizing those skills above those that are infinitely more important
Let me flip this around. What if the article about motherhood ONLY had women doing scientific study? One computer programmer, one chemist, one mathematician… would that be an accurate representation of Mormon women? Would it be an appropriate visual model for what women can do or are supposed to do or anything like that?
Can you imagine being required to attend a monthly meeting where, for two hours, you could only choose between: programming in C+; relational database construction; css-based design; memory installation? 🙂
Ah, Sharilee, I have not ever been able to remove the gauze image from my mind. I still get Christmas cards from Brenda. She’s here in Utah county. Do you keep in touch with Roxanne?
I stayed in touch with Roxane for many years, but I kind of lost track of everyone, and made sure they lost track of me, as I went through a very unpleasant divorce. It was an interesting time in my life . . . ‘It was the best of times, it was the worst of times . . . it was a time of light, it was a time of darkness ‘
I would love to get together with you and Brenda sometime when I’m down that way. The kids will be going to Michigan to spend some time with their Dad so I will be a lone woman for the whole month of July. Oh the places I’ll go and the things I’ll do! 🙂 Maybe I’ll come down that way and we could have lunch or something.
Love it! I cannot imagine a month of solitude. You’ll have to fill me in. 🙂
Okay, I understand what your saying. I DO see your points Ali, I guess it’s just that since I’ve never interpreted things the way you have, and evidently the way others have as well, that it’s hard for me to accept it as a truth, rather than just as an interpretation. It’s clearly true and factual because it’s there to see, that there aren’t photos of mothers doing some of things you want to see. And I agree that they need to be included. I also see how someone who is just particularly aware of it, or is sensitive to the issue, or isn’t familiar with the church, could note the pictures, and draw the same conclusions. So I won’t even attempt to argue that point.
But I still don’t see that, or even any of the other things mentioned as evidence that that the Church DEFINES motherhood by homemaking skills and domestic tasks. Nor that those things are put above others that are infinately more important. In fact I’ve ALWAYS heard and felt that though the church DOES strongly encourage learning those domestic skills, even for the Young Women, that they’ve ALWAYS put matters of the Spirit, which ARE infinately more important, far above that of domestic skills.
So I DO understand what your saying, and even agree on some points. Maybe we’ve just had different experiences– and maybe that IS partially due do a difference in age and how the church is evolving. Naturally, homemaking was alot of crafty stuff, but from the very begining of my homemaking experience, we also had courses in home safety, first aid, self-defense, basic car repair, budgeting, fitness, an aerobics instructor came in and showed us how to properly do weight and resistance training, we learned how to use the internet when it first became the rage, and I’m sure there are other things that just aren’t popping into my head at the moment.
For Sharilee’s benefit– I’m 38, and if I recall properly from earilier conversations, I am a few years behind you and Ali.
facethemusic- You bring up a good point that those of us that aren’t necessarily into the arts and crafts probably noticed it more and were/are more sensitive to it. I’ve never necessarily had a strong issue with the Church ‘defining’ womanhood and motherhood by homemaking skills and domestic tasks, but I certainly see what Alison is saying and I do remember as a youth that the emphasis was on marriage and taking care of a home and children with no emphasis on continuing education or developing skills that could be used outside the home. In fact, I remember for those that did go on to higher education many, MANY of them used to make comments like, “I’ll study to be a teacher so I can at least use my skills as a mother.” There was really very little expectation of little girls growing up to do anything other than clean house and cook meals. Now, I grew up in a small town, too, so maybe we were a few years behind even the mainstream.
Anyway, all of this said, I guess it’s important to acknowledge, also, that regardless of our other talents and interests, the core of motherhood really is raising up children unto the Lord and teaching them the gospel and reaching out to the Lord’s other sons and daughters and blessing their lives through whatever talents and skills we have. This can be done in so many different ways, and today I believe that is much more acknowledged than it used to be. Whether we are a mother who loves to cook and raises her children on hot, nutritious meals and fresh baked bread and is known throughout the ward for delivering the yummiest meals in time of need or the mother who takes her children along with her as she serves in the community and feeds them warmed up leftovers or fast and easy crock pot meals (okay– not fast, but easy), as long as we are doing our very best, it is acceptable to the Lord. There are many more examples, but I’ll try to keep this one fairly short. The point is that I am grateful to live in a world where we recognize that women have many varied talents and they are all acceptable to the Lord, which matters, and to the rest of the world, which doesn’t really matter, but is nice. I admire women who love to cook and sew and there have been plenty of times I have almost wished I was one of them (Hey– I recently fixed a zipper in my performance suit to go on tour to Vienna! I was so proud of myself!) I admire women who can program computers and design websites and do all manner of fancy, technical stuff (I used to be among them, but alas, that was before a 5-year hiatus, and when dealing with computers, that’s like a lifetime! It’s like starting over.) I am also very satisfied and pleased to be a mother who is raising her children on heavy doses of community involvement. There are lots and lots of benefits for my children and as they say– no matter how much you give, you always get more back. So, as long as we are all focused on caring for our children in the best way we know how and working hand in hand with the Lord to get His guidance and following His promptings to be doing what He would have us do, we certainly are fulfilling our role as women and as mothers, and He loves us all right where we are in this moment.
As I tried to point out in my previous post I do believe that in the past that womanhood was defined by the classic domestic tasks. I don’t for a second think that women back then were any different than women of today and I know for a fact that there were women that felt stifled and unhappy with having to fulfill that role…not only because that was what society dictated but because there wasn’t another option. You couldn’t just microwave a pizza or make hamburger helper or even go out to eat if you didn’t enjoy cooking…there are so many options open to us today that no one has to fit into that mold anymore. Generally speaking it is less expensive to buy clothes than to make them, it’s oftentimes more economical to buy canned food instead of doing it yourself, bread is easier and cheaper to buy at the store, the list goes on and on. All of these advancements help women so that if there is something she doesn’t enjoy doing she doesn’t have to spend her time on those things.
I think it is easier now as well to have access to many different interests. If you are interested in something there are so many diverse ways to pursue that interest on your own. I was never very involved with Homemaking for that reason. I always figured that if someone really wanted to make some crafty thing for their home that they would go out and do it themselves rather than wait until there was a meeting dedicated to that craft project.
I think I have gotten away from what I was trying to say though. I don’t forsee that the definition of womanhood is going to be changed that quickly. It is fairly recently that women have had more options available to to them. I imagine that this generation of women is beginning the transition. Maybe when our granddaughters are mothers ideals will be different.
Oh, Alison…you would have loved our last Enrichment Meeting. It was completely about computers…web design, programming, digital photo stuff, and so on. There are quite a few women in our ward that have their degrees and work in the computer science field.
Alison,
All of this talk about motherhood reminds me of something I would like to post, but it would be better posted as an article and then commented on. Is there a way to do that on my own or do you need to have special permission?
Please advise.
Thanks!
I should tell you that my mother would beat you up if she heard you call me Ali. She changed her first choice in names for me because she did not want anyone to call me Ali! If you need a nickname, I prefer Fireball. 🙂
I think that we DO the things that are important to us. I think learning to be patient and have other Christ-like characteristics, understanding and being able to apply scripture, service to others, etc. etc. are FAR more relevant to making a Godly home than tie-dying paper, toll painting, stiffy fabric decorations, paper cutting, scrapbooking, and almost anything I ever, ever did in Homemaking meeting. And why would we spend so much TIME and all the RESOURCES on those things if they were not central and important?
I cried at my monitor while watching Sheri Dew talk about women of God, because it was as if someone, finally, saw the same thing. Our time should be spent on things that bring us closer to God. PARTICULARLY our time as an organized…ahem…religion (not to be confused with an organized craft store or quilting group).
Again, I don’t condemn ANY of those arts, crafts, or skills. (Rebecca can attest to my needlepoint obsession last fall.) But I do not think that the church’s FOCUS on those peripheral things was any more appropriate than an intensive focus on any other kind of interest or hobby. Because the things we did almost exclusively were, just that. Mostly hobby-type activities, not even learning efficient methods of critical housekeeping skills.
Please try to understand that not only is this from my personal perspective, but from a particular time and place. I got the same emphasis at seminary, at church, at school. Teachers who balked at teaching calculus to “a girl who’s just going to go home and have babies.” Seminary teachers who told us that we would have to be at-home-polygamist wives to go go the celestial kingdom. I was too young and inexperienced and immature to sit myself down and say, “Alison, the fact that we HAVE to attend a craft night every month and the ward spends a bunch of budget on it, has NOTHING TO DO with whether these things have any eternal value.” I couldn’t think of any other alternative except that those things the RS stressed MUST be of significant value.
That was why my experience at the fair was so important to me. I couldn’t see that the Church approved of anything I did until then, and I wanted my life to be acceptable. That experience validated my own personality and interests and allowed me to expand that to other things.
Off to karate. Back later. Great input, everyone.
Oh! Sorry to Mom! Actually, I started calling you that because Kathy did. So I thought it WAS your nickname! Okay, so it’s either Alison or Fireball from here on out.
Hmmmm.. Fireball is so much more fun!:jumping:
I love the name Fireball! hahahaha Descriptive, too, IMO.
I wonder, just maybe, if the craft thing wasn’t the Church trying to send a message but instead giving women something MOST of them LIKED to do to give them something to gather around and socialize. Or maybe the women doing the activities thought that the skills matched with homemaking.
To be honest, I don’t remember feeling that it was a subliminal message (because I’ve never really been the domestic-y type naturally), but actually was glad to have a chance to do something I wouldnt’ do naturally on my own. So I had sort of a different take on it all.
Doesn’t this sort of correspond with the change from Achievement Days to Activity Days that underscore gospel principles? Our daughters are learning to be daughters of God earlier on, no?
And that talk by Sheri Dew has to be one of the all-time best talks by a woman. EVER.
Confession: I don’t attend enrichment meetings because they are usually 1) purely social or 2) crafty. I have so much on my plate right now, that I’ve opted to do something more important (be with my daughter and attempt to get a good night’s sleep.) I feel guilty about it, but it’s there, all the same.
I agree and I disagree. I mostly agree, but I do think there is something to be said about how expectation changes our perspective on things. I don’t sit around every day bummed out that I can’t fly. But if I had had wings last week–or saw other women with wings–I might be. Does that make sense? In other words, I think the fact that we SEE other options, makes it more likely that we will be discontent feeling that OUR choices are limited.
As you alluded to, I don’t think my grandma ever wished she could have a microwave pizza, since she had never eaten pizza and microwaves weren’t invented.
Absolutely! And that makes the skills of sewing, canning, etc. at least less crucial than they used to be. To be clear, though, it was the emphasis on non-essentials that stood out more to me. Anyone remember coffee table grapes? Holly Hobby crackle ceramics?
Amen. And I think that avenue has been available most of my adult life. The gospel is what LDS women have in common. Not an interest in kitschy crafts. So it seemed odd that our get-togethers centered around the latter rather than around the former.
This is a really good point. Something my husband likes to bring up about other transitional issues. I want immediate change but organizations (and people) don’t often work that way.
I would have loved it. But do you do it every month and are you expected to go? 🙂
I’ve been wondering when someone would mention those glass grapes!! LOLOL
I really have to run. Busy for the rest of the day with getting my daughter’s braces off, openhouse at the District Offices for an outgoing principal and wedding shower down towards SLC. I won’t be back till later, so ya’ll have fun while I’m gone. I’ll write more when I get back.
Sorry, I had to laugh at this. During Freshman orientation at a state university here in MIssouri, we were told by the college president this exact same thing. His prediction that most if not all of the women would drop out of college once they found a husband. I resented that back in 1977 and I still find the attitude resentful.
You bring up a great point about how our whole country’s culture has changed, the church’s culture along with it albeit more slowly and not always in the same direction or at least not to the extreme.
I think sometimes it’s hard to understand the influence of a culture you haven’t lived through. I remember arguing with women years ago who were only a few years older, about how much discrimination there was against women. I, basically, accused them of being extreme because I had never seen such things myself and, really, couldn’t imagine that things had been that different. At least not so relatively recently.
Your whole perspective changes when you LIVE through the changes they were talking about. Kind of like how my kids just cannot fathom that curly hair, shoulder pads, and leggings could ever, ever, EVER come back in style. 🙂
*cries* I have curly hair!
All things being equal, I hope those things don’t come back in style. Especially banana clips and t-shirt clips. *shudder*
I do hope you know what I mean. Some people always have curly hair and some always have straight and some are always in between. But you know the stick straight hair I’m talking about, right? Totally 60’s. Then we had Farrah and curly and poofy and big hair. Then it went straight again.
I don’t even know what banana clips and t-shirt clips are, Silver, so I guess you’re safe with me on that count.
Banana clip:
T-shirt clip/ring: looked like a large ring with a bar through it. I couldn’t find any pictures, or I’d show you. They were a more fashionable option to tying a knot in your shirt. They went well with those plastic bracelets that were so popular.
Oh, yea, I know what you’re talking about. Hey, I still wear banana clips.
Just kidding…
Well – my husband informs me that banana clips are back in style, though they’ve upgraded somewhat. I’m not exactly the fashion guru. It’s basically black for me. 😀
Ah, so you’re goth, Silver? 😉
lol, my mom too, we were not allowed to be called a nickname, she said she gave us our names for a reason, to be known by them, so friends were not allowed to call us other names. ( That was way comma splice, sorry ) Anyhow if anyone called and asked for Tony instead of Anthony or Tasha instead of Natasha, my mom would respond that no such person lived there. Mine was a hard one to try to make a nickname out of, you can’t do to much with Clerissa, one friend tried to call me Riss, but I didn’t respond let alone my mom 🙂
Too funny, Clerissa.
Reminds me of a totally unrelated weird parent moment. Since we mostly lived in Utah County when I was a kid, 99% of all our neighbors were Mormons. We had family night every single Monday night, without fail, and if someone called during family night, my dad would answer it and yell, “Haaaaappy Faaaamily Niiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight!”
I was MORTIFIED, but it was pretty funny when it was the bishop calling. The bishop apologized all over the place and said he’d call back later. 😀
More accurate would be “boring.” With my coloring, black is almost the only color I can wear that they’ve sold in the stores for the past several years. I don’t do pastels or brights.
I used to hang out with goths in high school, but I never did the makeup thing. I was more of an artiste type – you know, the drama people with pale skin, ponytails and black.
LOL, Alison, I can just picture your dad doing that! I love it!
Hey Ris and Ali, hows it going?? (Sorry, I’m all fired up over the book club. Who would think a Mormon book club would get my hair to stand up?!)
Just remember that Alison wasn’t advocating the book, she just wanted us to explore it together. 🙂
The truth is, Tracy, the institutional church in my youth did not give much allowance for these differences. Or course there is no commandment to cook or sew or do crafts, but that is ALL we ever did at homemaking. The things that were presented as being valuable were not most of the things I liked: computers, reading, math. In fact, I’d go so far as to say that the emphasis given in Relief Society would have many believe that even doing really inane stuff like making wax canvas tissue holders was more important or more worthy or more righteous than being a scripture scholar. After all, what did we spend our time promoting?
One of my points is that DOCTRINE is distinct from practice and even policy, but I did not recognize that as a young adult. So the practice and policy screamed very loudly in my ears that I did not fit and that what I did with my time wasn’t right or good.
Do you remember the June 2005 Ensign? The cover article was Susan Tanner’s Strengthening Future Mothers. (Great article, by the way.) But the cover and article photos consisted of mothers and daughters: sewing; cooking a roast (with dad looking on from afar, apparently anticipating the great meal the “women of the house” would serve); ironing and folding laundry; arranging flowers; grocery shopping; quilting; preparing a FHE lesson.
No women reading the scriptures? Or reading at all? No women teaching a lesson? No women writing or speaking or studying? No women exercising or playing catch with the kids? No woman teaching their children math or science or how to use a computer or how to ride a bike?
This was only two years ago. Again, it’s not doctrine. It doesn’t mean there is a revelation commanding flower arranging skills. But these kinds of emphases ARE part of the institutional church, they do teach and direct us, and they do influence us. In fact, in many ways such things define for us what it means to be a good mother or a good LDS woman.
BTW, go to your ward library on Sunday and ask to check out the picture of sister missionaries. 🙂
I’ll try to address some of your YW statements in the other thread, later.
Thanks for bumping this up! This topic has been on my mind – -every time I hear another woman say, “I’m not a ‘typical’ LDS woman.” I just wrote about it for our RS newsletter. If I ever get a RS blog up, I’ll link to this!
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